279. Conversations with God - Neale Donald Walsch

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This is a transcript of a special livestream I hosted for the Conscious Awakening Network, with special guest Neale Donald Walsch.

Kara Goodwin: [00:00:00] Welcome everybody. I'm so excited to see you all. We are joined today by the amazing Neale Donald Walsch, so thank you everybody for joining. You may be here with us live in the zoom chat. We are streaming this on the conscious awakening network and also, recording for the meditation conversation podcast.

 welcome. I'm your host, Kara Goodwin, host of the meditation conversation podcast, the podcast to support your spiritual revolution.

And I am so honored today to be joined by Neil Donald Walsh. He has [00:01:00] written 39 books on contemporary spirituality and its practical application in everyday life. He has nine books in his conversations with God series with book one remaining on the New York Times bestseller list for 134 weeks. His latest book is the God solution published in December 2020.

So this is a recording from a live stream with the conscious awakening network. I do these live streams at least once per month. And there really are so uplifting with a powerful group energy. There's such amazingly. Wonderful souls who've joined in. If you want to stay connected so you don't miss your chance to join these free events, please go to Karagoodwin.com and sign up for the newsletter at the bottom of the home screen. So you can be alerted when it's time to register. 

You're in for such a treat with this episode. It really is just amazing. What comes through Neale [00:02:00] in these interviews? This is my second interview with him. So go back and listen to episode 185. If you haven't heard that one yet. In this episode, he's going to talk about how you can have your own conversations with God. 

In addition to other profound insights about forgiveness, what is required of us by God? And he even distills the thousands of pages of his conversations with God series into one sentence. So let's dive into it, but really quickly, before we start just a word about one of the sponsors of meditation conversation. 

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Kara Goodwin: And in our last. , interview Neil in episode one 85, I went on and on in the introduction about how great you are and that you're this legendary author and how your work has actually been foundational in my own path. It was one of the early, I think the earliest kind of consciousness shift books that I, engaged with.

It was, it blew my mind. But in that [00:04:00] episode, you were very clear that you are just a person and you're not this amazing guy. So I'm going to pick that up now I can learn. and I'm just going to say, here's this guy, Neil, and he wrote some books. And they were excellent and you've probably read them too, and they probably blew your mind and shifted your consciousness, but no big deal.

So I can learn. I can learn. Is that a better intro? 

Neale Donald Walsch: Yes. Thank you. Even though you said, I'm excited today to have this amazing person. And I just wanted to start off by saying there's nothing amazing about me. And anyone who knows me will be glad to tell you that I'm far from amazing. But, you know, as Cara just said, I'm just an ordinary human being who had the same experience we're all having.

It's just that I actually say it out loud and most of us keep it to [00:05:00] ourselves. but by the way, if you do not agree with everything that Cara says. Then you are having a bad defeat. And if you want to avoid a bad defeat and rather have a good win, Then you will agree with everything that Kara Goodwin said.

Kara Goodwin: I love that. That's right. See more wise words. Nobody wants a bad defeat. 

Neale Donald Walsch: No, good win is better than bad defeat. 

Kara Goodwin: it's my real name too. well it's my married name, but. It's the name I've had for a couple of decades now. 

Neale Donald Walsch: So you've been married since you were 12.

Kara Goodwin: Patty's agreeing. Thank you. Thank you both. Thank you. yeah, it's been a long time now. Not quite 20 years. I got married in 2004, so next year will be 20. Oh, well, I'm just going to throw you into the deep end if you don't mind. And [00:06:00] this is probably going to be easy for you anyway. But can we talk about purpose?

And I know that a lot of your teachings are around the spiritual aspect of human life and that we, you know, identify a lot of times we identify as being human, but we are these spirits in human form. So what would be, in your opinion, the purpose of this physical experience? 

Neale Donald Walsch: Well, I have a thought about what I was told in my conversations with God.

I'd like to help people who are watching us right now to know that you just said about me, you said, Neil, I know that a lot of your teachings are about etc. I don't have any teachings. These are not my teachings, and I wouldn't want anyone to think that these are my teachings. All I have done is to pass along [00:07:00] to anyone who might be interested, what I was told in my conversations with God.

And I'm very clear that we're all having conversations, as I mentioned a moment ago, that we're all having conversations with God all the time. We're simply calling it something else, with this intuition, a sudden insight, an epiphany. You know, a moment of awareness, whatever we want to call it, but I don't want anyone watching this program to think that I'm here to share my teachings, because I have no teachings to share.

But I can tell you what I was given to share with others in my conversations with God with regard to purpose of life, that we are in fact, spiritual entities, that every one of us is at our basis, a spiritual entity. I use the word soul. We can use whatever words feel natural or normal or comfortable to you.

I would say that we are all souls, and that our soul [00:08:00] has agreed with itself to move into a physical reality. To come to the earth, or by the way, for that matter, any other place in the physical universe. I think that many of us have visited other locations in the universe, and maybe even had lifetimes. In other locations, but we're having this lifetime on this particular planet, but it's the same reason that we would incarnate anywhere in the cosmos.

And the reason for our incarnation is to place us into a contextual field. It allows us to experience who we really are, because in the system that's been set up in life itself, it is necessary for us to have a contrasting element to who we really are in order for us to experience who we really are. If I could put this in simple [00:09:00] terms, Kara, let's just pretend, metaphorically speaking, that I am the light.

By the way, I'm not making that statement. I'm not the light. So don't go there. Anybody, but as a metaphor, if I said, I am the light. It's one thing to know that about myself, or really frankly to know anything about myself to know that I'm compassionate, or that I'm caring, or that I'm loving, or that I'm forgiving, kind or generous, or whatever it is humorous, whatever I want to know about myself.

It's easy for me to know those things about myself, but for me to express them in the world in a way that allows me to experience myself, it's exact opposite must exist. And to go back to my metaphor. If I want to say that I am the light. I can't experience myself being the light. I can know myself as the light but I can't experience myself being the light unless there is the darkness [00:10:00] in the absence of the darkness.

The light cannot be experienced or expressed. Therefore, we know that when the opposite of who we are appears, our opportunity is, in fact, to bless it, to thank it, for demonstrating itself, for bringing itself to our awareness, that we might know, through the demonstration of who we are, our true identity.

And that's why all the great masters, I like to quote, a guy who lived a couple thousand years ago, But there are many masters who've said in one way or another, each in their own way, they have said, raise not your fist to heaven and curse the darkness not, but be a light unto the dark, that you might know who you really are.

And all those whose life you touch might know who they really are as well. [00:11:00] And so our purpose in allowing ourselves to experience the physical reality is to give ourselves an opportunity to express the wonder, the glory, the happiness, the joy, the magnificence of who we really are.

And so we come not only to experience that, but to expand it, to make it even larger, a larger and larger version of ourselves. Or if I could use a common word for that experience, to evolve. So to put the whole explanation in one sentence, I would say that we come to the world of the physical in order to evolve who we really are and become a grander and grander version of our true self.

You know, I could have made all that up. I didn't. It was given to me to share. But even if I did make it all up. Here's what I just got living it, whether it's true or not, has changed my life. [00:12:00] And it turns out, has touched the lives of millions of other people. It never would have occurred to me that when I produced a book called Conversations with God, that it would be read by 15 million people in 37 languages.

It simply would not have occurred to me. But, not bragging, just saying, that's what happened. And these are the kinds of things that occur in the lives of people who set themselves on the path of demonstrating. who They really are. But Kara, it's not going to be easy, because it's going to invite us, I was almost going to say require us, but nothing really is required of us.

But it will invite us to do some extraordinary things, like for instance, bless, bless your enemies, and pray for those who persecute you, and do good to those who do you evil. So, this notion of why we're here [00:13:00] is going to invite us. To do some extraordinary things. You know, when a man slaps you on the right cheek, turn and offer him your left.

When someone asks you for your coat, offer your shirt as well. And when someone demands that you walk one mile with him, go with him twenty. And

then see what happens in your life. See how life responds to you, and how you begin to experience yourself, express your true identity. Just a thought in answer to your question. Just a thought. I could be wrong. Of course. About all of this.

Kara Goodwin: Thank you That's beautiful. Thank you. Thank you for that. And you talking about the being the light and that duality, that dual nature of this physical world. It makes me think of your children's book, little soul and the sun. Yes. And, and you do also in conversations with God, talk a lot about [00:14:00] the dual nature of things.

 you know, that's really an illusion good and bad and right and wrong. And all of that is there, tools for us to just, as you talked about, I wonder. If there's no actual bad, do you have advice about how to know what the best action is for us? Like, how can we use that information in the best way without kind of feeling like everything's meaningless?

Neale Donald Walsch: Well, of course, everything is meaningless. That's really, that's, you know, that's one of the most important things for us to understand. As I was told in Conversations with God, Kara, Neale nothing has any meaning, save the meaning you give it. That's the greatest gift from the greatest giver of gifts. The greatest gift from God is that nothing has any meaning inherently.

Things mean what we say they mean. That gives us [00:15:00] the power to decide and then to express and to experience who we really are. Because, and by the way, this is, these are just a pile of words that I spew out here and say to people. I've had the experience of that. I've been in a room with three different people, myself being one of them, me and two other people.

All three of us have had the same encounter with life, but all three of us had three entirely different experiences of it. Somebody thought the joke was funny, hilarious. Somebody thought the joke was bad, not funny at all. And someone actually thought the joke was cruel. Couldn't believe that the person told that joke.

The same joke heard by all three people. So guess what? In fact, life is meaningless. And I want you all to put that on your bathroom mirror. Get a magic marker or a felt tip pen and write on your bathroom mirror. Life is meaningless. Nothing has any meaning, [00:16:00] save the meaning I give it. Then, be careful about the meaning that you give.

To certain events, somebody not calling you, somebody snubbing you, somebody saying this, somebody being nice to you, somebody making love with you, somebody failing to make love with you, somebody cheating you, somebody giving you more money than you should get. You know, have you ever been to the grocery store and gotten more change than you should have gotten and realize that they put a 20 instead of a 10.

And you stop yourself and you say, Oh, excuse me, ma'am. I think you gave me 10 too much. All of you have had that experience or that kind of experience. All of you have had moments in your life when you said, Whoa, wait a minute. Wait a minute. I'm not going to let this one pass me by. This is not who I am.

And that's really what we're talking about here. And when you have those kinds of experiences repeatedly, And then expand your expression of self in those moments. [00:17:00] Then you experience the glory and the wonder of your own evolution. In your last moments on this planet, in this particular lifetime, you put your head, if you're lucky enough to die in that way, back on the pillow, and you say,

no regrets. I didn't say no sadnesses. I didn't say no moments of unhappiness, but I did say, no regrets, because I met the moment as it was presenting itself in a way. That allowed me to know I really am. Wow. If somebody knows a better way to live, I'm all ears.

Kara Goodwin: I love that. Thank you. So, you know, that there's so much there that kind of makes this next question moot. so we'll do our best. But there are a lot of people who are suffering, on this planet. And [00:18:00] I wonder about your thoughts around suffering and if there are any antidotes to that, in addition to just taking everything in stride, as you mentioned.

But, does anything come to mind in terms of antidotes to suffering? 

Neale Donald Walsch: Kara, what I'm going to say may sound, if we're not careful, because nothing has any meaning, save the meaning you give it, folks. So you can give whatever meaning you want to give to what I'm going to say, but some of you might say, like the guy who told a bad joke.

Some of you might say that what I'm going to share with you now is a bit cruel, but I have to tell you what I was told. Suffering is unnecessary under any circumstance or condition. Suffering is merely our decision that what is happening should not be happening. But if we agree. That what is happening is placed in our life perfectly as an opportunity for us [00:19:00] to announce and declare, to express and fulfill, to become and to experience, here we go again, who we really are.

Then we don't disagree with what's happening. And conversation has also told us, Neale, what you resist persists. Therefore, resist not, resist nothing. But simply allow what's occurring to occur and allow yourself to know that it can be used in ways that benefit your purpose in coming to the physical reality.

So now I did not say, by the way, there's no such thing as pain. . please don't misunderstand. I didn't say there's no such thing as pain, but pain and suffering are two entirely different things. I've seen a person in incredible pain, I mean, real physical pain and smiling about it because I was at the birth of my triplets and I watched their mother smiling.[00:20:00] 

She lose a pain because she understood that the pain was worth. new life. Having been there at a moment such as that, which is a glorious moment to be at the birth of anything, a kitten, a dog, to say nothing of your own children, but to be at the birth of your own children is glorious because it brings forward the metaphor that pain produces the birth of new life.

And when we see that metaphor in every moment of pain, then we can receive the pain in a way. That causes us to experience the painfulness without the side.

You know, Kara, this is interesting for me to talk about this because I realized that what I'm essentially saying is that sadness and happiness can exist simultaneously in the same moment. Again, that's another thing that [00:21:00] people might say, wow, this guy's really Strange man saying those things, but I want to share with you that my experience has been sadness and happiness can be experienced simultaneously at precisely the same moment.

By the way, if you don't think I'm right about that, ask any man who has walked his daughter down the aisle to marry her beloved. I've had that experience. And I know that I felt so sad that I would no longer be, you know, the number one guy in her life. And so happy that she had found someone to be the number one guy in her life.

Sadness and happiness, you know, we've all experienced those tears of sadness and happiness simultaneously. That's the answer. To the question of suffering, when we shed tears of [00:22:00] happiness at the opportunity that the suffering has given us, then it no longer feels like suffering. It can still feel painful.

We embrace it as simply another, dare I say it, gift of life. And I want to go further than that, to say even our own death can be experienced that way. And that is the way spiritual masters have experienced their own death. I could, of course, be wrong about all of this. But I don't think so.

Kara Goodwin: That's so true. The, the dual nature of, I hadn't really thought about the ability to experience sadness and happiness in exactly the same moment. that's really powerful as well. Well, So we've talked about your own. 

Neale Donald Walsch: [00:23:00] Excuse me for interrupting. I'm sorry, but I was, I wanted to make that last point really, vivid for people.

I've had not only that experience walking my daughter down the aisle. I've had that experience watching my mother die.

It's incredibly sad, obviously, that she would want to be with me and feeling incredibly happy, knowing where she was going and knowing that she knew where she was going. You know what the priest said when he came out of the room? He was, he went into the hospital room in the emergency ward,, and he came out to give my mother the last rites of the Catholic Church.

And he was pale as a ghost. And we all said, you know, the whole family was there, of course. We all said, father, is everything okay? Did she pass on while you were there? Well, what happened? He said, no, she didn't pass when I was there. He said, your mother must be some kind of saint. I said, why would you say that the priest looked at me and , He said she was comforting me. 

She was saying, father, it'll be fine. [00:24:00] I know exactly where I'm going.

 So I've had the feeling of credible sadness and credible happiness at the same moment. The day, my mother went home.

Kara Goodwin: wow. Thank you for sharing that. That's. That's so powerful. Well, , you've referred many times to these conversations and that you wrote them down, but you know that people are having these types of conversations. You know, each individual is having it. Do you have advice on how people can nurture that?

Relationship with God or if they don't feel like they're having conversations or they feel very one sided. Do you have any advice for people on to how to have their own conversations with 

Neale Donald Walsch: God? Yeah, I actually written a book about it. And they'll be coming out on the 14th of November of [00:25:00] 2023.

The book is called God Talk. And the book talks about how we can all have our own conversation with God if we choose to do so. Again, to repeat what I said earlier, Kara, we all already are having our own conversations with God. We're simply calling it something else, but there's not a person I've ever met who has not had a moment of enormous insight.

Or sudden clarity about something or an epiphany, if you please. Or in fact, as I said earlier, a moment of women's intuition, whatever you want to call it, but we just seem to know more than we have a right to know based on our own experience. Something just comes to us and all of a sudden, we know that as well, how to develop that first we have to agree that there is a source.

of enormous wisdom and clarity in the universe. Do you know, surveys have been taken on this planet by anthropologists in recent years. They've gone to [00:26:00] all the nations of the earth, not just one or two places, but they were careful to go to just about every location there is.

And they asked people on the street, one question, a one question survey, do you believe in a higher power? 85% of the people said yes. I can't describe it. I'm not sure I know what it is. I don't know how to define it. I don't know what it wants. If anything, I don't know what it does, if anything, if it doesn't get what it wants, but I do think there's more going on here than meets the eye.

So the first step to answer your question directly is for us to acknowledge There's more going on here than meets the eye. It probably is some sort of higher power. Or as my friend Bill said, well he didn't say it directly but he put it in his play called Hamlet. And he had his character Hamlet say this, there are more things in heaven and earth Horatio than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

And there are. So that's [00:27:00] step number one. Step number two? Is to acknowledge that God is communicating with human beings all the time. And we have evidence of that. Hundreds and hundreds, I would say thousands, of testimonies from people. From times in ancient, the world to the modern world. People are telling us right and left.

Yes, I was given this information from another source. A source outside of myself. I'm going to call the source God. Step number three, we have to acknowledge that we are worthy. For Because that's where the big leap occurs. Okay. God talks to people. I get it. multi millions of people agree that God talked to Moses, that God talked to Jesus, that God talked to Muhammed.

Bless his holy name, that God talked to, Buddha, that God talked to Catherine of Genoa, that God talked to the Blessed Mother Mary. That God talked to Teresa of Avila. That God has talked to men and [00:28:00] women through the ages. We all agree that God apparently has communicated. In fact, Catholics say that God continues to talk to the Pope.

That when the Pope speaks of things having to do with faith, he speaks without error. He cannot make a mistake. So we all agree, apparently, most of us agree that God does talk. But do we agree that we are worthy for God to talk to us? That's where the leap of faith comes in. Because God will talk to all of you, even Kara.

That was supposed to bring a small smile to your lips. 

Kara Goodwin: Oh, even, I thought you were about to say, even Kara, somebody. Yes, even me? Oh, that's wonderful. 

Neale Donald Walsch: So apparently that means that we're all worthy. Yes, right. 

Kara Goodwin: Am I the, I'm like the bottom of the barrel, I guess. Like if he's even talking to Kara, then everybody else is definitely 

Neale Donald Walsch: okay.

Everybody else is included. So we [00:29:00] have to really embrace our worthiness to be spoken to by God. Step number four, having embraced that, is to not dismiss the information that's coming to us from an apparently separate source, to not simply, you know, call it, it's just my imagination, or it's not really real, or it didn't really happen, or I'm making it all up, or in some way dismiss these bolts of lightning that strike us and bring us insight and awareness and understanding.

And by the way, they're not always just statements of huge truth. They're often just feelings. What should I be doing next? How do I respond to what's happening right now? And we suddenly move into a feeling that sponsors an action, allows us to experience ourselves at the next level of our own magnificence.

So that fourth step is to not dismiss the messages when they come to us in the form of [00:30:00] words or feelings or understandings or levels of awareness or sudden expansions of our consciousness, or for that matter, that come to us by sometimes unusual avenues, like a podcast that we just happened by coincidence.

To be watching and then finding the fifth step is to not dismiss what we've heard by giving it no attention, but to do what it is that what we've just been given invites us to do or to be that is don't put it on the shelf for when I have time later. I'll think about this tomorrow, or to somehow or another, set it aside to act on what you've been given right here right now.

If you do that every day of your life, I promise you, in 60 days, you'll begin to feel,

Neale may want to call [00:31:00] it God, maybe I'll call it life, you know, the energy, whatever word I want to use, but I'm connected to something larger than myself. And I can call on that aspect of life to serve me. In my movement through this process that I call life itself, that's my thought about it. And that's how I would answer your question.

Thank 

Kara Goodwin: you. I love it. All the, like, it's like I even said in the intro, it's so practical and, and applicable. And, I mean, I'm very familiar with your work so I'm not surprised by this but I wonder if you want to talk about it there's nothing in that in terms of worship. Yep. Or, things that we may feel through upbringing would be necessary to have that connection with God.

I wonder what you might have to say about worship and because that can be,[00:32:00] something that might be important for people in their, spiritual understanding is that there's a right way to do that. And the necessity of it. do you think that there is a right way? Is it even necessary?

What are your thoughts there? 

Neale Donald Walsch: Well, my thoughts are irrelevant. But what God said to me might have some value. I was told directly in my conversations with God. And you know what? I gotta stop myself. Because when I talk that way, some people think I'm being arrogant. And I don't mean for that to sound arrogant when I talk about my own conversations with God.

Actually, I'm far from feeling arrogant about it. I'm feeling very humbled by the fact that we are all having conversations with God. But I'm humbled by the fact that I was able to recognize that is to re-cognize, that is to know, again, to be cognizant once more of what's actually happening [00:33:00] and I am receiving this information from that highest source in the universe, the higher power that I happen to call God.

So what I was told and what I has have come to understand because of what I was told by God is that, God doesn't need anything. God doesn't require anything. God doesn't demand anything or command anything. For the simple reason that I said, as I said, God doesn't need anything. God is the highest power in the universe.

It is the name that some people give to the higher power. I want to say the highest power. So what could the highest power need? You know, what do you need from the ant that's crawling across the kitchen counter in your house? what do you need the ant to do? To bow down to you and worship you?

Or maybe you just help it outside and say, sweetheart, you shouldn't be in the house. You should be outside. And you, maybe you put a little piece of paper or you allow the ant to crawl in your hand. [00:34:00] You take the ant outside, blow it off. allow it to find its way home. So God does not need our worship.

And God has allowed me to know that religions that have declared that not only does God need our worship, but that we must worship God in a particular way. Because even if we worship God, but do it in the wrong way, we're still going to hell. That a person who believes in a higher power, honors the higher power, worships the higher power, prays to the higher power, accepts the higher power in their life.

But simply doesn't do it in the right way is going to hell that. God says, no, you don't understand. You don't understand either. You do it one way, my way, or I will punish you in eternal damnation. For the rest of your eternal life, you will suffer unbelievable torture in the fires of hell because you were a Buddhist, or a Muslim, or a Jew, [00:35:00] or a Hindu, or a whatever.

You didn't belong to the right religion. The God of my understanding said to me, Neil, sweetheart, a Jew is as good as a Christian is as good as a Muslim is as good as a Baptist. Baptist is good as the Hindu. A Hindu is good as a Mormon, not Mormon. no. Mormon Mormons are absolutely going to hell.

But what am I saying what's the matter with me?

And an atheist is as good as all of the above.

If you've ever held a newborn, in your arms, and I have, I've done it on nine occasions with my nine children. ask yourself. What did I require or expect or demand from this wondrous expression of life do I need it to worship me?

And of course the answer is no, I need nothing. I need nothing from it. I simply want to love it. I simply want to give it [00:36:00] all the love I have in my body, all the love I have in my heart, all the love I have in my mind. I simply want to give it all the love I have to give, and I need nothing in return from this beautiful, precious child. That is, again, to use a metaphor, our relationship with God. God holds us in her hands, and he says, trust me,

which you might feel good, if you were open to receiving my love.

Kara Goodwin: Well when you were talking about being sent to hell because you didn't practice the right religion or so forth. I wondered if you wanted to expand, in your conversations have has insight been given from God about hell.

Neale Donald Walsch: Yes, God has said to me, Neale, Neale, Neale, . [00:37:00] There's no such place as hell. 

Kara Goodwin: I was waiting for you to say only Kara's going to hell.

 just her. It's her own place.

Neale Donald Walsch: Paddy

is applauding. When you get Paddy's applause, you realize you've really hit on a huge truth.

God said to me, Neale. Who would have created hell? why would I create a place that you call hell or Hades or whatever you want to call it, a place of eternal suffering? Neil what would be my reason for doing that? Since God cannot be hurt, damaged, injured, frustrated, angered, annoyed in any way.

So, so, so why would I create a place of suffering to say nothing of eternal suffering for something that you might have done during this little smidgen of eternity that you call this particular lifetime. You know, in proportional dynamics, it would be like punishing someone for a thousand years for something that they did for 30 seconds.

To use proportional dynamics. Our lifetime in this body [00:38:00] versus eternity is like 30 seconds against a thousand years. And we call that celestial justice. God says, Oh no, you know, you made that mistake. In your 30 seconds of being alive, so we're going to punish you for 1000 years, you'll be sorry. I promise you, you'll be sorry that you didn't do what I demanded, but you know, in the book to God solution.

It is stated, most of the world's human made problems with each other, the difficulties that we have getting along with people on the planet. Would disappear overnight if we suddenly decided to redefine God to define God is what God really is pure love, the kind of love that requires nothing in return, that even hopes for nothing in return that needs nothing in return, Kara, we can't even love the [00:39:00] person on the pillow next to us until we can, until one day we wake up next to that person on the pillow next to us.

And we realize I need and require nothing from this person. I just want to love this person completely. Totally. Absolutely. No matter what.

Yes. Even Kara.

Kara Goodwin: That's very generous. Oh, that's beautiful. Well,

Neale Donald Walsch: one last statement on that point. When we can say that to ourselves in the mirror, I'm having fun and just jostling around and having a good nature time with you, Kara, but truly when we can say it to ourselves, without laughing, when we can say to ourselves, God sees me as perfect, just the way I am.

[00:40:00] Mistakes and all. Misunderstandings and all.

Now I've made some mistakes in my life. There was that time back in 1947 I recall, and one or two other things that I've done over the past 80 years of my life, but in my 80 years

I think I've come to understand that God embraces and accepts me just the way I am. Mistakes and all that's why I want my family and they all know what I've all told them to put four words on my gravestone. My wife has promised me that if I go before her, she'll make sure those words are on my gravestone.

My children as well have agreed. There'll be four words on my gravestone. And what are those? Now that was fun.

Kara Goodwin: I love that. That is great. I wonder as we start to wrap up here, if there's, if you [00:41:00] could give listeners one thing to remember in terms of their spiritual development, is there anything that comes to mind? 

Neale Donald Walsch: Oh, sure. Absolutely. It's the single most important message that I received in conversations with God.

I didn't hone in on that. I didn't really separate that out. Until I had to, but a few years ago, now, I guess, many years ago, Matt Lauer asked me on the Today Show, which is telecast around the world by I think NBC. And Matt said to me, he had me on as guest, you know, on the show. And he said, Neil, you claim to have talked to God.

So he said, fair enough. If that's you, what you say your experience is, what's God's most important message to the world. I thought, Oh boy, talk about putting me under pressure. But the pressure wasn't good enough. So then Matt added, we had about [00:42:00] just 30 seconds left. Can you put it in one quick paragraph?

I said, yeah. And then it came to me. I looked at the camera and I said, God's message to the world in one sentence, forget about one paragraph.

You've got me all wrong.

Kara, when I went home, I thought about that deeply. And I scanned through the pages of the Conversations with God books. And then I found what I consider to be the single most important sentence in those 3, 000 pages of dialogue. I asked God, what does it take to make life work? What is it that I don't understand?

Obviously, there's something I don't understand here. The understanding of which would change everything. What is it? God said, sweetheart, so you think your life is about you and your life has nothing to do with you. Your life is about everyone whose life you [00:43:00] touch and the way in which you touch it.

But when you understand Neil that is what your life is about, you will see that in fact in the largest sense. Your life is about you, because the way you touch others is the way you touch yourself. What you do for another, you do for yourself. And what you fail to do for another, you fail to do for yourself, for a very good and simple reason.

There's only one of us.

I know it looks as if there's more than one of us, because we look different to each other.

The fingers on your hand look different. They function differently. They have different purposes and different appearances. So they are individual, but not separate from your hand itself, nor is your hand separate from your body. You are therefore all fingers [00:44:00] on the hands of God.

I could, of course, be wrong about that.

Kara Goodwin: That's beautiful. I love looking at it that way of the important thing is, it's not about us, it's about what we're doing with this opportunity to be human and to affect and help others. that's profound. I love that. So it sounds like we have a book to look forward to in November.

You said you have a book coming up. 

Neale Donald Walsch: Yes, it's called God Talk. God Talk. And then in March or April of 2022, my last book, which has now been finished, it's written, and I've sent it off to the publishers as well. That book is called Putting Death to Death.

And it's about bringing the idea that we die to an end, and

changing our thought [00:45:00] about what happens in our final moments in this particular body. And what impact that has. On our life while we are in this particular body, and then I'll be done. That'll be 41 

Kara Goodwin: books, right? 

Neale Donald Walsch: Yes, ma'am. Who's counting? 

Kara Goodwin: I just did some quick math in my head. I counted. 

Neale Donald Walsch: Well, I knew I could count on you.

Kara Goodwin: Nothing gets past me.

Oh, well, I can't wait for those. So, so, God talk is in November and when is putting Death to Death coming out? In the spring of 2024.

Okay. Well, well, thank you so much, Neale this has just been so wonderful. the conversation was wonderful, but just I feel so great. I feel like I've just had this big cleansing or something. So, really beautiful. I really thank you for your time for being here today. 

Neale Donald Walsch: It was sweet and lovely.

And generous [00:46:00] of you to allow me to share this time with you and with those who will be joining you in watching this program. So thank you. Thank you, Kara. I've enjoyed it immensely. And I'm grateful for the opportunity. 

Kara Goodwin: Thank you so much. And thank you everybody who has joined. And I look forward to the next time maybe you can come on and talk about God talk in November or leading up to it.

Neale Donald Walsch: I will definitely be here then for me next time. Oh, wonderful. 

Kara Goodwin: Great.

Thank you. Thank you so much, everybody. 

 Okay. All right. Does anybody have any questions? I think somebody was trying to chime in there. 

Neale Donald Walsch: Oh, this is great. No questions whatsoever.

Oh, okay. Okay. I was gonna say, it was great when nobody has any questions, then you know you've done either the incredible job or the worst job of your life, one or the other. 

Kara Goodwin: Randy, do you want to go ahead? 

Participant: I was born [00:47:00] Jewish. I love Buddhism. I love I have a lot of Christians in my life. But I have a hard time understanding, and you talked about this, which I was very grateful for, the division of one religion saying, if you are not this, you're going to go to hell, we won't help you.

So, does it mean that if one person says, I take Jesus as my savior, But they're lying, cheating, and stealing, and someone else who is practicing Buddhist, Muslim, Mormon, whatever, is rescuing dogs, exposing elder abuse, , going up against injustice on this planet, but they don't, 

Kara Goodwin: they don't say that I take Jesus as my savior over every other belief out there, that this is what I feel like the older I get, the less I understand life on earth 

and humans.

And I grew up reading your books and I was shocked to have found this, and that I'm even talking on this call now.[00:48:00] 

Neale Donald Walsch: Randy, you are deeply aware at the deepest part of you, of the highest wisdom in the universe, which is that we are all one, that there is no division. We have allowed ourselves, I mean as a species, human, the human species, has allowed itself to create artificial divisions, which has produced alienation between people of different nations, of different races, of different colors, of different sexes even, men against women and so forth, to say nothing of different religions, and different political parties, etc.

or different sexual orientations. So the deepest wisdom of the universe is we are all one. And of course you don't understand life on this planet, [00:49:00] because human beings are a very un evolved species. Very, relatively speaking, very young species in the cosmos. And we're acting like children. We're acting like two year olds.

Because we have embraced the notion of separation. And everything is separate from everything else. To say nothing of people being separate from other people. So, all you need to do is move through your life, living into your awareness that there is no such thing as separation. And then have compassion for those who believe that there is separation.

That there is only one way. That there is only one path. That they are somehow better than someone else. And for that matter, even have compassion for yourself, because there have been probably one moment I bet there was at least one moment in your life, 

 if you're older than 25 I'm going to [00:50:00] guess that at least once in your life, you might have had a smidgen of a thought of feeling a little bit better than someone else. Have you ever felt that in your life at all? Too much. So we all, we, you know, we, I'm sure all of us have had moments where we've had that feeling that I'm better than that other person.

So when I can have compassion on myself and then share that compassion with and for others and come to a place of understanding how they could be feeling that way. That doesn't condone the feeling, doesn't justify the feeling, doesn't mean you agree with the feeling, doesn't mean you hope that they continue feeling that way, but it does mean that you understand how they could have come to feel that way.

And you know what's something I was told? Understanding replaces forgiveness in the mind of the master. So [00:51:00] when you move through your life, demonstrating that you understand full well how a person could feel that way, and that you then demonstrate compassion for them, residing in that understanding. And then choose to use life as you are living it as your demonstration of what is truly real.

There is no separation. Then you walk through life as a demonstration of what is really true.

And then you will know why you're really here.

So I join you in not being able to understand until I did, until I finally did. Because I was born and raised a Catholic. at least I assume you were born into the Jewish faith into a Jewish family and a Jewish background. But my dear, I was born into. A Catholic family. So I was not even able to look at it [00:52:00] from outside of it.

I had to look at it from deep inside of it. I was told these things for the time I was seven years old. Let me share with you a little story. Randy when I was nine, I remember this vividly that I even recall how old I was the priest would come into our classroom once a week to teach us that, catechism, the doctrines of the Catholic church.

And one Wednesday afternoon, Randy, the priest was telling us about the difference between mortal sin and venial sin. That venial sin is a sin that, you wouldn't have to go to hell. In order to pay God back for it, you have to go to purgatory, which, but it's not hell. Oh, but a mortal sin, if you die with a mortal sin on your soul, you go straight to hell, no ands, ifs, or butts about it.

And so I raised my hand, my little nine year old hand father. Can you give me an example of what a mortal sin is? Because, I didn't want a commit any. And he said, Oh, sure. I can give you one that, that children can understand if you miss mass on Sunday. Without a good excuse.[00:53:00] 

You know, if you're caring for a sick parent, fair enough. Or if you're an adult and you have to work on Sunday, okay. But if you have no excuse, you decide to go play golf or whatever and miss mass on Sunday. If you get hit by a car on Monday and you should die on Tuesday, you'll be in hell. Because missing mass on Sunday is a mortal sin.

Now, Randy, my nine year old mind is trying to grasp a God who would send me to eternal damnation for missing church one Sunday of my life. Do you think that didn't send me racing to the confessional? Bless me, Father, for I have sinned. My last confession was a week ago. I missed mass on Sunday. Because in fact, I had missed mass that Sunday to go play baseball at the playground.

It was the big game of the year. It was the tournament game. And my teammates were saying, Neale, you got to be here. It's the big game. So I thought, well, I can miss mass one week. Never realizing that I was [00:54:00] committing a mortal sin that would send me to hell. Do you think that would cause me to look both ways when I was crossing the street?

After the priest told me that I raced to the confessional, which was the following Saturday to tell this poor priest who's sitting on the other side of the screen, he must his heart must have just gone out to me because he realized nine years old. And I'm crying in the confessional. Please, Father, tell me that God forgives me.

I'll never miss Mass again. Well, Randy, I've now missed Mass for 50 years.

I can see where I'm going. I'll meet you and Kara. Because you know what, I mean, who said it was a George Bernard Shaw who said, all the interesting people are there anyway.

So you're perfectly right. Randy, it doesn't make any sense and move through [00:55:00] your life in a way that allows people to know what it's like to be in the presence of someone who doesn't approve and doesn't accept and doesn't agree, but who deeply understands. And demonstrates compassion and love for others, no matter what.

Beautiful. Thank 

you. We have a hand raised for Lynn. . 

Participant: Yes. thank you both. And, Neil, I don't know whether this is going to put you on the spot. As if I haven't been on the spot from the beginning of the program. Yes, exactly. So, I am maybe one of few people in the world who had an opportunity to sit with Anne Frank's cousin.

in Anne Frank's [00:56:00] grandmother's house in Switzerland. And I was there to ask Anne Frank's cousin if we were in fact related. Because my name was Frank. And we came from Frankfurt am Main in Germany, I had played Anne Frank, I had won awards for playing her, and I feel like Anne Frank inside of me. And so my goal in sitting with this individual was to unlatch my satchel.

Of all my documents that said Frank, and everything else related to the Frank family and my family. I had traveled miles from my home in Seattle to meet with this lovely individual and his wife [00:57:00] in the family home in Switzerland. And when it came time for me, Neale, to unlatch my satchel with all the documents, I couldn't, I didn't, and...

What I came to, I wanted to know DNA wise. Were our two Frank families interconnected, but I was afraid to know responsibility wise. Because if indeed I was Anne Frank's cousin and we look alike, what would that require of me in my life? Going forward, and that's my question, and I'm now about your age, I'm 77,[00:58:00] and before I die, I would like to have peace with this understanding, and I recognize on another level, It doesn't matter.

Neale Donald Walsch: What matters is what I feel in my heart, and I feel in my heart. We are related. I understand her path in the concentration camp. And I feel every single day of my life as if I am also in a concentration camp. So, thank you.You are required to do nothing. Yes, I know too. Requirement is not a part of the soul's journey. Because requirement and free will cannot exist side by side, simultaneously. Requirement and free will are mutually exclusive. I was told by God that we are all, that is, every [00:59:00] soul in the universe has been given free will.

Therefore, we are required to do nothing. Nothing is required of us because of our past. Because of what may or may not be true about our ancestors, or nothing is required of us by God either. So, you know this, you've announced that you know it. So your next step is simply to step into the knowing of it.

And there you will find the peace that you say. you'd like to experience before you leave this planet. Step into the peace of your knowing, and know that you know. Then, I was told, there are some people who don't know. I mean, they really don't know. They don't, and they don't know that they know.

All of us know everything, by the way. None of us are sent here without knowing. What we need to know in order to do what we came here to do, [01:00:00] but not all of us know that we know when you know that you know, and you are among the cognizant team. Those who know. And so, if you say that you know that you're not required, then your next step is quite simple.

Step into knowing that you know, and acting on what you know. And let that be how you live the final moments that you have, whether it's 3 years, 10 years, or 15 more years, or whatever it is. That you're on this planet in this particular body. Know that you know, you know? And Neil, does this mean that I do confirm to myself my inner truth?

That Anne and I are of the same DNA. I mean on one hand, that sounds [01:01:00] absolutely preposterous to put that out to a public. But. This is for me. This is for my, as you say, my gnosis. 

You would have to ask yourself why you would say that. See, why would you want to share that with somebody else? 

Participant: Well, I'll give you an excellent reason. I am an animal activist. I am an international animal activist, and I have an understanding of how to bring slaughter to an end.

And if I were to talk to journalists, news people, whoever would have a listening ear to help the animals, and I mentioned to them, Hello. I am Anne Frank's cousin, you know from your own work that having that feather. In my cap would [01:02:00] give me greater admittance to those that could extend my voice to help the animals, because it would be Anne's voice to, if you feel that would be the result.

Neale Donald Walsch: If you would use your sharing of your knowing. To produce that outcome and that result, in a gentle way, then I would do what you feel called upon to do, what you feel would benefit your work, and for that matter, benefit the animals that you're working for. then, if you think you have something difficult for other people to understand, to share, try telling people you had a conversation with God.

So I know all about how it feels to let people know something about you, that you know ahead of time that they might have a difficult time embracing or accepting. But I would not share it arrogantly. I would say, let me humbly. share with you my deepest [01:03:00] inner feeling. I believe that Anna Frank and I are related, have been related, share the same lineage.

I believe, frankly, that I'm her cousin. And so I bring to you, whether we are cousins or not, the message of Anna Frank, do what you can do. 

Participant: That's beautiful. that's absolutely beautiful. I will say two expressions in foreign languages.

One is Beirush Beishan, which is Sanskrit, the blessings already are. And Anai Hu, which is also an East Indian chant, which means peace, which is what you started our conversation with. Step into the peace. Within you. Thank you so much. Neale. 

Kara Goodwin: you.

Beautiful. Thank you. Simone. [01:04:00] Yes, please. 

Participant: Good evening. And I feel very humble. And I have a question. About forgiveness. This forgiveness of one's self. 

Is this necessary? Because I feel always guilty. Yes, for small things, because I have skin problems and so on, and then I think, oh, I have this issue. Does it, does it come from my food and allergy, or what did I do wrong, etc.? What would God say about that?

Neale Donald Walsch: Are you suggesting that the difficulties that you've encountered in your life are God's way of not forgiving you?

Participant: No, it's forgiving myself,

Neale Donald Walsch: my dear forgiveness is the most unnecessary expression in our emotional [01:05:00] vocabulary. I want to share something with you. God told me. God will never forgive you for anything. God will never forgive us for anything ever, because forgiveness is simply not necessary, because we cannot hurt, damage, injure, upset, anger, frustrate, or annoy God in any way.

Therefore, forgiveness is unnecessary. It's not necessary either for us to forgive ourselves. All that is invited. Is that we

seek to understand can I understand even why I did the things I did in my life in my younger years, that I now wish I'd never said or done. Are there some things that I wish I'd never said

there's some things that I wish I never did. Yes. Yeah, I had enough for instance just to give you an example. I had an affair. In my first marriage, we're talking now 50, 60 years ago, but I [01:06:00] had an affair in my first marriage. What was I thinking? What was I doing? And you know what, my dear? I can't go back and undo it.

I can't change what I did. But I can change how I feel about what I did. And my darling first wife was sweet enough to say to me before she left the planet. Neale, let it go. That was 50 years ago. I understand.

It was a half century ago. Are you still hanging on to that? I stopped hanging on to that 50 years ago. So, I don't even forgive myself,

because forgiveness is not necessary. That does not mean that I want to repeat behaviors that I regret, but it means I refuse to give in to guilt. My friend Elizabeth Kubler Ross, who I work with closely on a day to day [01:07:00] basis as a member of her staff, she's a psychiatrist, she's since gone home as well, but she used to say to me, Neale, fear and guilt are the only enemies of man.

So be guilty about nothing and forgive yourself and you have nothing to forgive yourself for nothing. Least of all the things you've mentioned.

So then I can find peace with that knowing that there is no forgiveness. No forgiveness is necessary. That is correct. That's my understanding. And you can also find peace by sharing peace and giving peace to everyone whose life you touch. To think to yourself whenever you're having any interaction.

I don't care if it's the mailman. I don't care if it's a delivery person from UPS. I don't care if it's somebody you're talking with on the internet. In the next 30 days, you will interact probably with at least one other person, 

When you find [01:08:00] yourself interacting with the world at large, say to yourself, I am peace. My peace I bring. My peace I live with you. Peace be with you. Thank you. Thank you.

Kara Goodwin: Thank you. Paddy. Yes. Do 

Participant: you like to ask a question? Yes. Neale, in your contact with God, that must've taken place, do you have a regular meditation practice at all? 

Neale Donald Walsch: No, I don't. I mean, at least not in the conventional way that people think of meditation, Paddy. That is, I don't sit down, with a candle going or music playing or whatever, close my eyes and go through the whole ritual.

That some people call meditation. But Patty, my answer to your question is, no, I don't meditate, in the classic way, but I consider life a meditation.

 I can meditate doing the[01:09:00] just, I can meditate, just walking in the woods. I can meditate just, writing when I'm writing an article for a magazine or interacting. So I think that life is a form of meditation that takes many different avenues, but doesn't have to look a particular way.

So no, my, my conversations with God come to me and come through me. In the normal everyday activities of my life, you'll excuse me for saying something I'm going to say now, Patty, please forgive me, but some of the things that I've said in the previous interview that I did just here just now with this sweet and gentle person calls herself Kara, some of those messages came right through me from source, and you when you believe in that kind of magic, Patty, then you not only realize that you can speak for source, But that you are [01:10:00] performing the magic of a sorcerer.

Ooh.

I can live with that. That makes sense to me. I'm glad. Now, on the other hand, you're going straight to hell. If you don't clean, if you don't clean up your, those shelves behind you, your life, your house looks like a royal mess. Get those shelves straightened out or you're going to hell.

Kara Goodwin: We'll have a big party. 

Participant: I could do, but there's too many books there that I've still got to read yet. 

Neale Donald Walsch: Okay. All right. Then live in the clutter. Well, yeah, that's true. But, yeah, I know where most things are. Oh, that's funny. I'm just having fun with you. Just having fun with you, Patty. I know you are.

I know you are. That's fine. I understand that. But the answer is no. You know, when you consider all of life of meditation, then you actually, here's what's interesting about this, Patty. When you consider your whole life of meditation, [01:11:00] opportunities for true meditative moments. In everything, including, just rinsing out the dishes in your sink.

I go to my sink, I take my glass that I just used for to pour myself some milk, and I clean the milk out of the glass and pour some water into it. And then suddenly, I meditate on the glory of the water falling into the glass pouring out, the cleaning process, the feeling of the inside of the glass.

And I just watched the whole miracle of life right in front of me, simply rinsing out a glass of milk and putting it into the drainer. And I think, wow, there's beauty in every moment. All we have to do is see it.

Yeah. Okay. I can understand that you, rather than having to meditate, you actually see the messages. You pick up the clues.

It's not without needing to meditate. It's without meditating in the way [01:12:00] most people think meditation should be done. Everything to me is a meditation. Combing my hair is a meditation. I mean, it doesn't get any better than this. No, it'll take you much longer to do that lot than it does me.

Kara Goodwin: Oh my goodness. This is great. I love how you said. Your sorcerer. This is one of the things that I, that, I remember from the first time I read conversations with God was all of the different, you did it in the interview too, with the recognition and the recognition, and you do that with like remember and like, you know, coming all back together, re membering and all of the different ways that these, it's like these clues that are right.

They're in our language that we're speaking all day long. These little clues of universal truths that, again, it was just so expansive I just really get a lot from that. So thank you. 

Neale Donald Walsch: Yeah. [01:13:00] God's really good at playing with words for sure. Yeah. I've enjoyed being with you. 

Kara Goodwin: I really appreciate you, spending this extra time with us and everybody who was able to stay and, participate. This was really special. Thank you so 

Neale Donald Walsch: much. I enjoyed it immensely thank you. Wonderful. 

Kara Goodwin: Well, many blessings. Everybody. 

I'll you see you next 

Neale Donald Walsch: time, 

Kara Goodwin: Kara. Wonderful. Thank you so much.

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